Randy F - thanks for your thoughts on this. Lots of differing opinions, I guess. I had been wondering what the actual LAW (if any) states about this issue. Years ago, when I distributed political flyers, we were told not to put them in mailboxes, but rather rubber band or tape them to the door knob, but even then we never learned whether this was LAW or just a "guide" from the post office. Using the USC you listed, it states a box erected for receiving official stamped mail from the post office cannot be used [in any way - in or on top of or taped to] for un-stamped items. However, the post [that the box sits on] is NOT considered part of the box. So, there we have it! Thanks!
Randy F - thanks for your thoughts on this. Lots of differing opinions, I guess. I had been wondering what the actual LAW (if any) states about this issue. Years ago, when I distributed political flyers, we were told not to put them in mailboxes, but rather rubber band or tape them to the door knob, but even then we never learned whether this was LAW or just a "want" from the post office. Using the USC you listed, it states a box erected for receiving official stamped mail from the post office cannot be used [in any way - in or on top of or taped to] for un-stamped items. However, the post [that the box sits on] is NOT considered part of the box. So, there we have it! Thanks!
DMM 508.3.1.2 states;
Door slots and nonlockable bins or troughs used with apartment house mailboxes are not letterboxes within the meaning of 18 USC 1725 and are not private mail receptacles for the standards for mailable matter not bearing postage found in or on private mail receptacles. The post or other support is not part of the receptacle.
Also, I failed to find any reference to a 15 foot "zone" leading to and exiting from a mailbox. There is a section that states that the area around the delivery point should be such so that the carrier is not impeded from mak9ng the delivery, but there is no specific distance stated.
I've got 32 years of service with 20 in Business Mail Entry and Mail Classification. I am sure that you know that these activities involve a lot of DMM research and interpretation. Only mentioning it so that you don't think I am just some nut, shooting off my mputh without knowing what I am talking about.
ol az hippie chick, You erect a mail receptacle with the sole intention of receiving US Mail. The USPS retains exclusive right to access that mailbox and excludes any others from doing so. Yes, you bought the box, yes, you set it up and, yes it is on your property. However, it is for your convenience to have a mailbox at your residence so you do all of that to make it happen.
The simple act of erecting a mail receptacle constitutes your acceptance of USPS and USC rules and regulations regarding its use.
Also.....the law use to be the post office only owned the air space in the mailbox. However, somewhere around the late 80s to early 90's it was changed to include around the box, flag and post. Including 15 feet in front of and 15 feet past the mailbox for vehicle usage. It was when the first larger postal vehicles (LLV) were made to replace the old jeeps. Of course it isn't very specific since some mailboxes don't have 15 feet in front or after due to the location of the mailbox. It is rather vague but since most people understand mailboxes are for postal use, they abide. It's the few butt holes that always want to challenge it. If someone puts a flyer on my mailbox, I would be tempted to call the police to report a break in and take them to small claims court.....I could use a new wide screen tv.
Btw.....the box set postal property. Technically they own the airspace in and around the box, flag and post. I've been removing layers for thirty years. Everyone. At our station, we give three to the supervisor and trash the rest as non obvious value since there is no postage on them. The supervisor is suppose to send one to the local police to report temporary tampering of the mailbox. One to the EED department who Calls the vender to offer them a time saving cheaper alternative called every door direct where the post office will deliver the flyers for them without expensive adverstisement requirements or bulk rate permit expense.....and the third to the postal inspections department that is suppose to keep track on repeat offenders. We had two cases in our zone where a lawn care service and a local restaurant repetatly ignored postal inspections warnings about putting flyers on the mailbox. The lawn care service went to court and lost and had to pay a $5000 fine to the postal service. The restaurant stop and agreed not to do it again to avoid the $5000 fine.
Well....we had a lawyer go on vacation once. Had the postal service hold his mail. A lawn care service put a flyer on his mailbox that the carrier didn't remove. It was on his box for sometime while he was on vacation. Some high school kids saw the flyer on his box and determined since it was there for days, he was gone. So they broke into his home and had a school party. Broke the up stairs bathroom and flooded the place. Causing eighty thousand dollars in damages. When the lawyer got home. He called the police who did a search of the home and found a cell phone in the upstairs master bedroom along with some used condoms in the bed. They traced the phone back to the high school kid who told the cops what happen. So they found the flyer and sued the four kids that organized the party and the lawn care provider for placing the flyer in the mailbox. The lawyer sued The five of them and won. They had to pay for the $80,000 dollar repairs plus the room, board and travel expenses of the lawyer while his home was being repaired. The lawyer now sends letters to homes that are broken into telling the residents if there's a flyer on the mailbox, the vendor will have to pay for everything that was stolen.....and the lawyer is winning. So good luck to this guy.
nice. Another good idea is to reuse the Missoulian newspaper delivery bags. Thats what i do. They make great mutt mitts, and i get a second use out of my newspaper bag.
Love reading you as much as ever.
xenophobic grief.....what's wrong with those people?
His devotion to the other 98% of the GOP platform is what drives me to do everything in my power to send Denise to DC to replace him. I'm sure he's a nice guy and I'm glad to see so many of my fellow veterans continuing to serve their country even after discharge but his Party has lost it's bearings and is foundering on Fascist shores. Voting for anything other than the GOP candidates is simply a matter of self defense-we cannot allow the Greedy Oligarch Party to continue their destruction of our government, the tool We The People use to protect ourselves from aristocratic rule.
I appreciate the story, but as with everything, there is so much more to it. Join the Montana Filmmakers & Media group via Facebook to learn more. https://www.facebook.com/groups/MTFMA/?ref…
Get an idea of film's economic impact in Montana, with actual numbers.
Here's a plan to have the film office, the tourism office, and the Historical Society working hand in hand to get more films made about the state, and thus more interest in coming here and spending money.
Hey kinney...I realize as a MSU Alum it is difficult being able to find your fanny with both hands ..."Engtsrom is a great guy and is paying for Dennison"s mismanagement" ...what in the heck are you smoking I need get me some of that. Engstrom has been in charge 6 years now and it has been a disaster---- stop with the blaming everybody else when does Engstrom take responsibility after he has been here ten years???
For crying out loud give us all a break.
Waste of time and taxpayer money. The police in Missoula have shot more people than the criminals and just how many gun crimes are committed in Missoula?
So.....cutting Jobs...cutting funding to various departments, cutting staff/hours and the like at the library....
Where the hell did they find the money for this little operation? If Engstrom is sharing his own over-inflated salary, I would support this...
But we all know he isn't. Is this where our Alumni "gifts" go? To finance another person who will not do a job, be a drain of financial resources, and end up failing?
Does the University, and the regents and such on the board, realize that CUTTING teachers, resources, funding for research and on campus facilities, actually detracts from any desire of prospective students to come here? Do they think that prospective students will read this and the other shenanigans that has plagued this school and say "Yes, i want to give them lots of money?"
As an MSU alum I have more than enough competitive spirit to shriek with joy at anything MSU might do better than UM. That being said I just recently left a job where I worked with several hundred colleges and universities throughout the country including semi annual trips to UM over the entirety of the Engstrom Presidency and several years of Dennison. Dennison was a great guy but stayed way too long and in the end gave too much unchecked autonomy to too many. I saw UM as a speeding coaster on loose rails and it went off with all the publicity around the legally exonerated Jordan Johnson. He may be innocent in the eyes of the law and actually innocent but the manner in which the Dennison admin swept stuff under the rug with his and other cases, ignored it or worse yet didn't know it was happening has put UM into a tailspin it may not recover from. The downward trend in the pursuit of Liberal Arts degrees at a school that yes has STEM majors but isn't known for them hasn't helped. Any father with a daughter (and maybe even a son) google's UM and that Krakouer book is going to be on page one for some time even though assault is horrifically rampant on too many campuses. This was a necessary risk, at the right time to attract the best possible candidate. Engstrom is a great guy, a great leader that was handed a collapsing ivory tower of cards. The alternative theories of pay after performance are the reasons you get middle or lower tier candidates in job searches. Crady may fail, but so could anyone in this position. UM is a challenge for the next enrollment executive. He is taking a risk taking this job. A bigger one than at any similar institution. They had to invest and invest big in this position. We are at a precipice in higher ed of a bubble. Under utilized two years, ballooning 4 years and a demand for more for less will see hundreds of institutions, a smaller percentage state run, shut down in the coming decade. MSU's growth is phenomenal and against the trend and UM has a lot to offer, I've met a lot of college presidents and Engstrom is the right guy he's just swimming up a swift current and paying the price for years of neglect. I hate saying that as well because personally Dennison was a great guy as well but he stayed about 5 years too long.
Facade -- you can put all the makeup you wish on that pig (giant tourist warehouse w/kitchenettes), it'll still be a pig!
Deja vu all over again....sort of....
The East Asians who migrated to the Americas from what is believed to have been Southwest Siberia can be said to have had a similar experience in all that they have lost and was taken from them by migrating colonialists in just a few generations. But the crimes committed on the First peoples of the Americas can not be compared to the migrations of today and deserve far more than just one line and I can not and will not try to serve that properly here.
Human migrations can be interesting:
From Africa to the world as a whole.
There was the First Peoples to the Americas from East Asia.
The Europeans to the Americas for colonialism.
To more modern times:
The dust bowl era mostly to California.
The rust belt to the southeastern part of the states for jobs and a better quality of life for their kids.
But the migrations are different now, seems to be more about whatever is trendy at the time:
Everybody in New England knows what a “Masshole” is.
Upstate New York disowns the city.
“Damn Yankees ruined The South”.
Wisconsin complains about Illinois.
Everybody from the Rocky Mountain states west complain about Californians.
Anybody remember Southern Utah or Colorado thirty years ago? Really some cool places before they were put on a map....
The new migrations seem to be focused on the rocky mountain states now, and specifically on Montana; but nobody comes to Montana for money unless you're a miner, real estate speculator, or a developer. So what is creating such a large draw? Why are so many migrating to a place that is expensive to live in and becoming more so as it grows and becomes more crowded and has few good paying jobs? Was it all those trendy magazine articles rating Missoula as the top ten of this, that, and the other thing?
Most Californians learned to be quiet about where they came from and why they were migrating here. Washingtonians were the opposite. They loudly and enthusiastically declared Montana to be “god's country” and therefor the trendiest place to be, and “Washington to be a hellhole” back in the late 90s, and by 2006, it seemed Washington state had annexed Western Montana. --why are local real estate prices nearly three times what local income can afford?
It is a bit too late, the horse has been let out of the barn, but we are experiencing some serious growing pains around here and we need to learn to step much more lightly and think about what we are doing to a place we all want to love before it is loved and capitalized on to death. I'm tell you that this cancerous growth this place is inflicted with is not sustainable and will kill this place! It has been seen many times before!
The “Last Best Place” is well on its' way to being just like everywhere else....but too expensive for locals to afford!
It's to bad this councilor and the others can't focus on something more relevant like getting spending under control.
Sandra - that's a good point; one I didn't think about. The box is YOUR property; therefore, the post office shouldn't have say about who else touches it. You, however, have that right.
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